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 Post subject: Another aspect to think about in regards to songwritingPosted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:33 am 
There is a definite dichotomy between Stacy's song-writing and Sherri's song-writing. Most of you guys have pointed it out quite well; totally agree that there's a difference. But this works in a unique way. If you look at Sherri's lyrics, they're really, really sad, upsetting, and bleak. And while Stacy's are introspective and occasionally melancholy, they don't have the same depth of pain Sherri's does. I would say that had it all been Sherri songs that were thematically similar to what's on there....it would be too bleak, too self-indulgent, to really enjoy. Stacy's stuff is a good balance--not only in terms of vocally, but her songs have an arrangement style that differs from Sherri's. _________________ "Die Sonne scheint noch" -- Sophie Scholl <3 <3 <3 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004 | Posts: 535 | Location: texas is the reason
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:45 am
I actually find myself connecting more with the "depth of pain" in "Ambulance," for instance, than most of the Sherri penned songs like "Smarter" or "Please". The reason is that "Ambulance" is heavier on metaphor and focuses on capturing an emotion, which makes it applicable to many situations. Conversely, the Sherri songs tend to be about very specific situations, and while she does an excellent job of capturing the emotions tied to those situations, they're just not as universal as Stacy's songs. Simply put, Stacy's songs are about the end of a relationship; Sherri's songs are about the end of her relationship. That having been said, other Stacy songs like "The Valley" and "Oxygen Mask" and "Kind" definitely have a more optimistic slant, and they balance the scales of the album, but it's definitely not just Sherri's songs that are bleak and upsetting. If Stacy had written more like "Ambulance" and "Watch It Die," The Valley could have been the downer hit of 2011.  _________________ INTELLECT AND ROMANCE OVER BRUTE FORCE AND CYNICISM Smokemonster |
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Joined: 24 Sep 2003 | Posts: 14510 | Location: Alone on an airplane, fallin' asleep against the windowpane...
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:51 am
Considering they were writing more from their experiences, and their experiences at the point where they wrote this stuff, those emotional characteristics fit the bill. ( 6-7 year age difference, 0 weddings vs. 2, and all that jazz) I think one thing about a band with multiple writers that differentiates them from Singer-Songwriters is that, one person can "fill the gaps" for another. If Sherri had to write an entire album, she might try and balance out the mood with songs of varying types (like for this album 192 days would be an example), but in a band, she was sparred that effort, or they simply chose not to use those songs in favor of Stacy's, and vice versa. When Stacy's record is done, she'll have had to fill out a tracklisting with whatever moods she things makes an album feel completer. Since she picked the running order for The Valley we might find that she may delve deeper into the heavier emotions for her record. I'm thinking of Silver Springs, and even though it's a cover, the recording and performance are very melancholy. So I think they can both go either direction, and perhaps it's just a matter of choosing which songs were the most appropriate for continuity's sake? _________________ yup, that's my name. FOR YOUR RATING PLEASURE: 4 LIKE Buttons, 1 NEUTRAL, 1 VEXED, 5 DISLIKE buttons. LC > FB           
= personal fave  = Eisley fans should dig it
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Joined: 09 Apr 2008 | Posts: 9654 | Location: Greater St. Louis Area
Last edited by wilsmith on Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:53 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:52 am
Stacy's are about pain, but they're not necessarily about her pain--which is good. I'm ambivalent about "Ambulance," though. It ended the album on a bleak note, and the more i listen to the album, the more out of place it seems at the end of the record. Maybe it was added because it was a "popular" tune on teh interwebs and needed to make an official appearance? Sherri's songs are definitely more narrative in style. She wouldn't be able to shirk off questions about them as being personal...because they are intensely personal, about real situations. That's why I like "I Wish" so much. You get both of them, with their styles, coming together. I wish it had been the song that ended the album, truth be told. _________________ "Die Sonne scheint noch" -- Sophie Scholl <3 <3 <3 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004 | Posts: 535 | Location: texas is the reason
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:00 am
As far as we all knew Ambulance was always meant for the album. They say the album is a story of sorts, and that's how the story ends... "am I gonna be alright? cause I know how it usually goes, I know how it usually goes." Now, for me, I was feeling the same way about the ending, but I don't know the exact story, so ending it that way makes me want to know what they mean about the story, as far as sequencing choices. Other than that, putting it on the end separates it from the Valley so it feels less like the Fire Kites EP cept if you have the album on repeat, and then The Valley follows Ambulance, just like it did on the EP  _________________ yup, that's my name. FOR YOUR RATING PLEASURE: 4 LIKE Buttons, 1 NEUTRAL, 1 VEXED, 5 DISLIKE buttons. LC > FB
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Joined: 09 Apr 2008 | Posts: 9654 | Location: Greater St. Louis Area
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:06 am
honestly, in my mind "Ambulance" feels a heck of a lot more like an overture to the album than it does the closing....like it should be the first track... _________________ "Die Sonne scheint noch" -- Sophie Scholl <3 <3 <3 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004 | Posts: 535 | Location: texas is the reason
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:18 am
So you're saying you like really the Fire Kite EP??? 
But yeah, I guess we can look at Ambulance as the Epilogue of The Valley and the title track as the Prologue Fair enough. That way their presence on the EP serves as a fitting preview, moreso we could have ever conceived at the time it was released. _________________ yup, that's my name. FOR YOUR RATING PLEASURE: 4 LIKE Buttons, 1 NEUTRAL, 1 VEXED, 5 DISLIKE buttons. LC > FB
= personal fave = Eisley fans should dig it
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Joined: 09 Apr 2008 | Posts: 9654 | Location: Greater St. Louis Area
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:21 am
the first two songs, yeah. but the arrangement of "Ambulance" is much more suited for an introduction--somewhat acapella intro, a rising build-up of the melody, and then the twinkly fade-out in barely three minutes, it just doesn't seem like it belongs there. and considering that the song is open-ended, with no resolve, it just feels awkward right there at the end. _________________ "Die Sonne scheint noch" -- Sophie Scholl <3 <3 <3 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004 | Posts: 535 | Location: texas is the reason
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:32 am
You've got me thinking of another album (blanking) that opens with an instrumental/ orchestral version of a track, and concludes with the fleshed out version of the song. Anyways, I think Ambulance is a stand along song, and an album that was musically built around that song in style and feel would have to be outright symphonic. It stands on its own, it's a singular work, that's also a song from this album, and when you have that strong of a song to include on an album, traditionally you just put it at the end of the record. Load the cd with singles at the the top, or throughout if you've got a killer album like this one, and end it with the pre-release single/ big hit that heralded the album (if there was one). _________________ yup, that's my name. FOR YOUR RATING PLEASURE: 4 LIKE Buttons, 1 NEUTRAL, 1 VEXED, 5 DISLIKE buttons. LC > FB
= personal fave = Eisley fans should dig it
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Joined: 09 Apr 2008 | Posts: 9654 | Location: Greater St. Louis Area
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:47 am
stacey is certianly the metaphor queen now. while sherri is more direct. that is for sure. personally while we all have opinions, i dont think anyone on here is saying that stacey or sherri should stop writting and let the other take over. people have preferences that is all. _________________ Wil's excellent description of me. wilsmith wrote: You're the Anti-Censorship+Topless Twitpic Parodying+Youth Group Video Directing guy that's a champion for the 1st amendment, Videogames as Art, and unrepentant file sharing... Instagram - Facebook - Twitter - YouTube |
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Joined: 09 Aug 2004 | Posts: 4838 | Location: illinois
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:51 am
mr pine wrote: personally while we all have opinions, i dont think anyone on here is saying that stacey or sherri should stop writting and let the other take over. I think people are only insinuating that other people are saying that over in the other songwriting thread, which is just a trainwreck. "What? You hate Sherri?" "No, I didn't say--" "YOU HATE SHERRI." _________________ INTELLECT AND ROMANCE OVER BRUTE FORCE AND CYNICISM Smokemonster |
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Joined: 24 Sep 2003 | Posts: 14510 | Location: Alone on an airplane, fallin' asleep against the windowpane...
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:53 am
wilsmith wrote: You've got me thinking of another album (blanking) that opens with an instrumental/ orchestral version of a track, and concludes with the fleshed out version of the song.
Anyways, I think Ambulance is a stand along song, and an album that was musically built around that song in style and feel would have to be outright symphonic. It stands on its own, it's a singular work, that's also a song from this album, and when you have that strong of a song to include on an album, traditionally you just put it at the end of the record. Load the cd with singles at the the top, or throughout if you've got a killer album like this one, and end it with the pre-release single/ big hit that heralded the album (if there was one). But where it gets problematic for me is that the lyrics state "I built a monument to the love we used to know" and "let me know if i'm gonna be all right" -- and the ending is actually: I need an ambulance I took the worst of the blow Send me a redeemer Let me know if I'm gonna be all right Am I gonna be all right? ‘Cause I know how it usually goes I know how it usually goes which works great if you're introducing the record--because it highlights the theme of the rest of the songs. but at the end of a record, it just seems like all the pain and misery that we went through for the previous ten tracks ... is starting all over again. it doesn't conclude well. at least in my humble little opinion.... _________________ "Die Sonne scheint noch" -- Sophie Scholl <3 <3 <3 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004 | Posts: 535 | Location: texas is the reason
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:56 am
mister_joseph wrote: wilsmith wrote: You've got me thinking of another album (blanking) that opens with an instrumental/ orchestral version of a track, and concludes with the fleshed out version of the song.
Anyways, I think Ambulance is a stand along song, and an album that was musically built around that song in style and feel would have to be outright symphonic. It stands on its own, it's a singular work, that's also a song from this album, and when you have that strong of a song to include on an album, traditionally you just put it at the end of the record. Load the cd with singles at the the top, or throughout if you've got a killer album like this one, and end it with the pre-release single/ big hit that heralded the album (if there was one). But where it gets problematic for me is that the lyrics state "I built a monument to the love we used to know" and "let me know if i'm gonna be all right" -- and the ending is actually: I need an ambulance I took the worst of the blow Send me a redeemer Let me know if I'm gonna be all right Am I gonna be all right? ‘Cause I know how it usually goes I know how it usually goes which works great if you're introducing the record--because it highlights the theme of the rest of the songs. but at the end of a record, it just seems like all the pain and misery that we went through for the previous ten tracks ... is starting all over again. it doesn't conclude well. at least in my humble little opinion.... I agree with this, and I can get behind "Ambulance" at the end of the album chiefly because I love the song so much, but I think it and "The Valley" should change places. "Till everything is fine" is a much better way to end an album that is, ultimately, about finding the right person than "I know how it usually goes". _________________ INTELLECT AND ROMANCE OVER BRUTE FORCE AND CYNICISM Smokemonster |
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Joined: 24 Sep 2003 | Posts: 14510 | Location: Alone on an airplane, fallin' asleep against the windowpane...
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 6:01 am
I think "I Wish" should end it, because that song is about hope. Plus it's the sister's co-write, and the song seems like a closer to a painful chapter. It also ends with the girls in love.... _________________ "Die Sonne scheint noch" -- Sophie Scholl <3 <3 <3 |
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004 | Posts: 535 | Location: texas is the reason
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Post subject: Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 6:03 am
Well, to invoke a past convo on these boards... Stacy wrote Ambulance for one of her sisters, that we all know, it wasn't about her own particular heartache. That came out in an early interview if I recall, so it's from the outside looking in. Thing is, Both sisters got hurt in a very brief period of time, and since all three went through break-ups for me, if there is a pseudo-narrative addressing all of them, I have absolutely no clue, other than in the very specific points of reference by Sherri, who's situation is being addressed, if not a meta-situation that's surrogate for any specific one. I gave up on thinking of it that way, and just embrace it as a collection of songs. And at 37 minutes, the easily solution is to just play the record again
Or consider it a cliff-hanger for the next release, sort of like an Eisley Empire Strikes Back which was the best Star Wars movie right??? As far as the The Valley I've always read that as Stacy being the youngest, and that being her skeptical view of the peaks and valleys of romance when presented with a suitor, and her determination not to beguiled for the worse, witnessing others travails from safe distance. In my head, that's where she enters the heartache story, since, as we all now know from their interviews and press for the album explaining the title, she also had a bad break-up in that time as well. _________________ yup, that's my name. FOR YOUR RATING PLEASURE: 4 LIKE Buttons, 1 NEUTRAL, 1 VEXED, 5 DISLIKE buttons. LC > FB
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Joined: 09 Apr 2008 | Posts: 9654 | Location: Greater St. Louis Area
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